Thursday, May 14, 2009


My sister was summoned into the schools guidance counselours office yesterday (she's in 11th grade, so they need to do post-HS guidance).

The counselour asked my teacher what her plans are for the year after HS, and my sister said which college she hopes to go to.
So the teacher said "What about seminary?"

My sister says I don't want to go to seminary.
Counselour: The school is going to pressure seminary, and I don't disagree with them.
Sister: Judging by the way I'm in HS I don't think I'd like it.
Counselour: Well you know, when you're going through shidduchim and they see a no for seminary, they'll want to know "why not?".
Sister: My sister didn't go to seminary.
Counselour: Is she married?
Sister: No, but she's going to be soon
Counselour: Oh, Mazel Tov.


Mikeinmidwood said...

Thats a lovely story.

G6 said...

Oh boy, do I sympathize with your sister.
Back in the "olden days" when seminary in Israel wasn't an absolute certainty, I too was called into my counselor's office.
Now, I was planning on studying Biology in college (a subject my teachers thought was oh-so-safe and appropriate for a Bais Yaakov girl....) and the lab sections were either 8am-12pm or 6-10pm.
In part because of this, when my counselor asked me what my plans were, I told her that I was planning on going to college during the day and seminary at night (yes there was such an option for college girls back then and for girls back from seminary wanting some continuity...). My counselor told me that Night Seminary wasn't "real" seminary... just "good shiurim" and that if I didn't go to REAL seminary I wouldn't get the kind of boy I wanted to marry. I simply told her that perhaps she didn't know "the kind of boy I wanted to marry".
Fast forward a few years. I am now happily married to a wonderful man who is respected enough in my community to be davening erev Yom Kippur mincha at the omud in my shul. Ex-counselor happens to be there. At the conclusion of the tefillah she leans over to me and says, "That was beautiful. Who is that?"
"THAT'S the kind of boy I wanted to marry!!!" :D

Rich Perkins said...

I HATE that whole "If you don't do XYZ or act in such and such manner you will never get a shidduch". Basically they want a bunch of sheep where nobody can have a personality of their own.

oh, and when my wife was in HS at a Beis Yaakov, she was told that if you don't marry a kollel guy, you are marrying second best. too bad she got stuck with a shlump like me who works hard and is actually around the house to help.

frumskeptic said...

G6- I'm happy for u. hehe :).

my sister doesn't even want to go to the 'not real" she just wants to focus on college. I suspect they'll drive her crazy next yr.

RP- one time while chatting during a free period in HS (the topic was kollel) one girl said 'ofcourse you would want a learner, you don't want to get abused by your husband do you?'

considering her father worked, I'm a bit concerned for her mom...

fave commenter said...

"My sister didn't go to seminary."

..and look how you ended up... :-P

happens to be, that teacher is the least of the agenda-pushers in the school...(dunno if that's a good thing or bad thing)

frumskeptic said...

fave commenter- :)

Oh how did I come out? Huh? whats wrong with me?!

hehe :-)
ANd please, you think anything can help my sister? She needs to get matching scrunchies (something seminary wouldn't teach her, cuz there she'd have to straighten her hair :))

kisarita said...

the shidduch crisis is an imaginary invention used to keep people in line

kisarita said...

Marriage is still everything. As long as you get married, then it's proof that you're ok. Your little sisters have what to fall back on, to give them a little confidence. You can thumb your nose at the doomsayers and point to your spouse as proof.

What about all us single people? With no such "comeback" Even your little sister, no matter how rebellious inside, will reject your path.

I'm sorry, I do not see this as a success story.

Moshe said...
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Moshe said...
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Moshe said...

stupid blogger keeps removing line breaks...

Moshe said...

Well you know, when you're going through shidduchim and they see a no for seminary, they'll want to know "why not?".

That's ok. I wouldn't want to marry anyone that would marry someone like you. :-P.

Most of my friends got married without any kind of shadchan. Then again, none of us would want to marry a frummie...

mlevin said...

A shadchan has a right to ask why? That's not the problem. The problem is that many think that it's essential for a choice of a bride. I would ask why someone decided to either go or not go to a sem. There are some people who really wanted to go to seminary for religious purposes and it has nothing to do with the current trend. Heck I know this woman (she's in her 50s now) who went to women's seminary three times. Last time was after her marriage. She feels it's essential for her soul. But than again, when she was young seminary wasn't a trend.

Tsivia said...

I'm relatively new to this world but I'm under the impression that until the last 10 years, most girls did not go to seminary in Israel. My rabbi didn't send any of his 5 daughters to a year in Israel, and 4 of them are married with children. I want to go but...I think it is a place for me...but not for everyone.
If a guy doesn't want to marry her because she didn't go to seminary, and seminary isn't for her, then he isn't for her either.

David said...

The problem is that if you don't go to seminary, you'll just wind up doing dangerous and irresponsible things like thinking independently, instead of thinking what you're told, and maybe even questioning (chas v'sholom). We can't have that, can we?